There will be several posts with information and images from multiple contributors depicting the 5-11 with 2 Special Alarms that occurred Tuesday night at 3757 S. Ashland Avenue.
In the meantime, here are a few images of the scene from Larry Shapiro.
The roof is in and heavy fire is seen throughout the building as viewed from the corner of Sectors 1 and 4. Larry Shapiro photo
Several deck guns work in Sector 1 from Engines 8 and 49. Larry Shapiro photo
Engine 16 was being fed by an in-line operation supplying water to companies working in Sector 3. Larry Shapiro photo
Firefighters monitor the elevated master stream working in Sector 3 off of Truck 33. Larry Shapiro photo
Squad 1A was working for several hours in Sector 3. Larry Shapiro photo
What would a winter fire in Chicago be without firefighters encased in ice. Larry Shapiro photo
6-7-6 was special called to the scene and put to work in Sector 1. Larry Shapiro photo
Images to come will be from Tim Olk, Steve Redick, Jeff Rudolph, Josh Boyajian, Dan McInerney and additional images from Larry Shapiro. Videos from Steve and Larry are also forthcoming.
#1 by Tom on January 24, 2013 - 7:55 PM
It sucks because whether it’s a pride thing or union thing or a city vs suburbs thing reasoning of a more harsh or ignorant regards because think of all the bordering suburbs to the south, north and west and NW Indiana towns that can assist the s/e side. That’s a lot of available resources and would make for a quicker avalibilty of resources to people residing on the outskirts of the city or a bordering suburb.. Plus, it would show the nation what a great comradery we have in this area. And, well who are we kidding, it’d just be cool to see the city amd suburbs working together on on more jobs.
#2 by DMc77 on January 24, 2013 - 5:14 PM
Hi Mike- my grandfather retired as Engineer of E77. I used to do just a bit of running around the west side back in the day.
I agree that in the last several years there have been more MABAS mutual aid going into the city both fire and ems. I work in Oak Park and from time to time run into CFD on Austin/North Ave. We have a firehouse on the 6200 blk of west Augusta and hear the sirens from the west side all day and night long. I would love it if we had 96/29 or 125/53 come in or we go to their still districts for fires, but I dont see that ever happening. That being said, I’m pretty sure we have responded to every MABAS request the CFD has made be it with an engine on a CQ to E107 for the LaSalle st. fire, every EMS box and we even sent our truck to Englewood for a power outage affecting several hi rise bldgs in the summer.
#3 by scott on January 24, 2013 - 4:13 PM
Hit send by mistake … continuing. This is no different than a MABAS suburb that has one or two co’s for every alarm (box, 2nd, 3rd, etc) vs many towns that have 4, 5, or more co’s per alarm. It all comes down to what works.
I guess everyone is forgetting about the extra alarm on W Nelson last fall… also another good one!
Finally, great to see the Deluge wagons used, but my opinion UNDER utilized. They have the ability to flow 3000-4000gpm but all the fires they have been used at recently, sure looks like just the 1-3/8″s tip being used (500gpm for non-fire folks). Bump that tip to the 1″ minimum and use them like they should be used! Maybe it’s the mistaken thought that the small tip has a farther reach…???
#4 by scott on January 24, 2013 - 4:10 PM
The LaSalle St fire also had much fire & run activity throughout the entire city that night. A very long term extremely knowledgable fire alarm operator who was the Senior that night made the phone call to the command van and basically told them that the city was almost out of companies and they needed help. Hence, the MABAS rqst for co’s to come to Chicago. This past fire, there where a few other working stills, but activity as a whole was not unusual. Nothing the city hasn’t dealt with before for 5-11s & up.
Also, the extra alarm response was reduced 7-8yrs ago (or was it longer). No addt’l trucks above a 2-11 unless they are special called. Used to be trucks on every alarm.
FDNY is not Chicago and vice versa. What works for one works for another. Sometimes reductions are to build stats for extra alarms and other justifications.
#5 by Mike McAuliffe on January 24, 2013 - 3:56 PM
DMc77, I could be wrong but in the last several years I got the impression that “all bets are off” when it comes to mutual aid. Cases in point: The Alsip lumber yard fire when the CFD sent tower ladders, engines, and chiefs. The Amtrak and/or Metra train crashes when the southern sububurbs sent ambulances directly to the scene. 5-1-1and 5-1-2 have responded into the suburbs. The CFD sent companies to Peotone for the Amtrak crash. Old Engine 58 was sent to Lemont for a large coal pile (or was it a tire pile?) fire. A fellow named Hoff requested CFD companies to assist Evergreen Park on a car versus train. (He had the CFD compaines check down the line to see if there were any more victims.)
About once every two or three years Cicero and Chicago fight the same fire together on a border street, albeit unintentionally.
Granted, it is not like L.A. County where they respond together on alarms, but is slowly, very slowly, heading in that direction.
I assume you were on Engine 77 at some time. It was a very proud and busy company with a long history. Too bad it could not have been saved. Maybe it will make a come back at Engine 38 some day. Lou Galante once told me there is still a need for small, single bay houses in large cities. He specifically had Engine 77 in mind.
#6 by DMc77 on January 24, 2013 - 2:53 PM
Two other things that occurred to me-
One, if I remember correctly, Local 2 may have language in their contract that addresses the mutual aid issue. This is why bordering towns don’t run into/with or receive mutual aid from CFD (the exception being Squad 7 into Div 20 and Squad 5 into some south side towns). Somebody with more knowledge on this can correct me if I am wrong.
2. In the past, you would sometimes hear the office call the command vans to see if they had any unused companies in staging. Sometimes companies in staging were sent to CQ to firehouses in the area, or in some extreme cases, returned to their own quarters lights and sirens if there were multiple extra alarms going on throughout the city. They would also call the academy and have them release companies from training and have them RTQ if again there was a lot of activity in their still districts or nearby.
#7 by Mike McAuliffe on January 24, 2013 - 2:24 PM
Tom, I was thinking about this Tuesday night. My best guess (and this is just a lowly fire fans guess) is that if they had a 2-11 or a high rise still and box they would have given it serious thought, but still would have held off unless they had an additional still and box and/or a couple of working fires in the outlying areas. Only the fire alarm operaters could tell us how close they came.
A 5-11 is really a 5-11 with at least one special because of the number of engines that bring special equipment to the scene.
One policy that the FDNY has, which the CFD should consider, is reducing the number of companies responding to alarms when they know they might run out of companies. I am thinking about cold boxes and high rise still alarms, to be specific. There were two separate high rise stills on the southside during the first hour of the 5-11. Fortunately, they were not at the same time and were not working fires. Yes, companies automatically change on high rise still alarms, but you could run out of trucks and battalion chiefs, in a big junk of the city, mighty quick.
Most of the cold boxes are also in the high rise still alarm areas. That is eight engines and six trucks that could easily go out the door within minutes of each other or even at the same time.
Yes, a good fire alarm operater would “pick off” some of the companies and divert them to other stills or EMS runs if needed, but a policy reducing the responses under certain conditions might be a better idea. (It might also hold up better in court.)
#8 by DMc77 on January 24, 2013 - 12:23 PM
CFD wouldn’t have called MABAS for assistance due to this fire. This fire was essentially “controlled” when the floors started to collapse and the exposures were covered. The difference between this fire and say the 5-11 at 135 S. LaSalle a few years ago is that the companies operating took a heavy physical effort to control the fire, and it wasn’t a sure thing that the fire was going to be controlled, so they had MABAS cover CFD houses. When the CFD co’s returned to quarters, they were given out of service time to eat, clean up and get their PPE straightened out.
In the history of the CFD, there have been roughly 600 5-11 alarms, and the number of times the suburbs have provided assistance (during fires) can almost be counted on one hand.
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#9 by Tom on January 24, 2013 - 8:36 AM
I accidentally posted this on the wrong post, and Im not sure if maybe this was touched on in any of the other posts or comments, but how close do you think CFD was to having to go interdivisional and call in the suburbs? At least COQ companies maybe….
#10 by David on January 24, 2013 - 4:43 AM
Looks like the second turret wagon (6-7-3) was at the scene as well, anybody knows if they used the rig?!
#11 by KB on January 23, 2013 - 6:46 PM
In regards to 671, it was taken out of service and was at E23’s house (19th and Damen) for years. It was a slightly bigger apparatus than 676 and 673 (they called it Little Mo). Ironically, within the last month, there have been two massive extra alarm fires very close to where 671 used to be housed (the 4-11 on 24th and Western and now this 5-11). In my opinion, it should have never gone out of service.
#12 by Brian on January 23, 2013 - 4:43 PM
5-1-5 happened upon the incident and called englewood requesting the initial still for smoke coming from the building. As he got the address he immediately upgraded to the box. As the first engine arrived he went to the 2-11. All happened within seven minutes of his initial notification of the smoke.
#13 by TIM OLK on January 23, 2013 - 4:36 PM
Ok all 515 was driving north on Ashland Going back to Engine 5’s house and saw smoke and fire and called it in
#14 by chris r on January 23, 2013 - 3:49 PM
according to the commish, he was off duty and noticed smoke coming from the building and reported it to englewood and the rest is history .
#15 by Chris on January 23, 2013 - 3:40 PM
Maybe I missed something but being north of 39th St, why was 2-2-1 not assigned ?
#16 by David on January 23, 2013 - 2:45 PM
@Scott: 6-7-1 is out of service for about a year and half now. Not sure if they’ll replace the rig.
#17 by Mike McAuliffe on January 23, 2013 - 1:15 PM
5-1-5 pulled the 2-11. Does anyone know if he responded on the still and box or if he just happened to be in the area? Just curious. An unusual event.
#18 by Scott on January 23, 2013 - 11:25 AM
Great pictures glad to read no injuries. Is unit 6-7-1 still used?
#19 by Carl on January 23, 2013 - 10:27 AM
Question How can there be a deluge unit 6-7-4? The City only has two 6-7-3 out of E 108 and 6-7-6 out of E 104? Any insight?
#20 by Admin on January 23, 2013 - 10:40 AM
only one way that can happen … a typo, which has been corrected.
#21 by Dennis on January 23, 2013 - 9:16 AM
Great Shots Larry, that was the coldest I have ever been at a fire before in my life. I was in one of the baskets of a tower ladder just trying to stay warm.
#22 by David on January 23, 2013 - 7:29 AM
Looks like the 60s are back. Don’t remember such a “season” of extra alarm fires for years.